And even if you talked endlessly to that reassuring gray-haired physician in the lead-up to your surgery, you know, the guy or gal who wrote the textbook on your ailment and who appears a shoe-in to be the next chairman of the school of medicine at the cutting-edge research institution where you've opted to get the very best care (you deserve it! And many of the commenters on here will fill seats when UA is 5x the price on Are all the posts from FAs at other airlines? The airline is hiring both pilots and flight attendants, given that its close to launching operations. Meanwhile my friends will be stuck in their entry-level cubicles. What they do at launch and what they do 2 years later can be entirely different. Not discussed here is the difference between flight hours and duty day. There isn't enough information to know whether this is a good deal or a bad deal for the "part timers" potentially taking this work. If the pay is off the mark, the marketplace will correct this soon enough: pilots have options, and they know it. It's extremely spot on that the second comment on this article was written by a guy whose photo is a selfie in his car while wearing sunglasses. 1200/month in 2021??? I would have loved an opportunity like this. Fly for less money and less stress. This isnt a job, its servitude by hopeless people who have been abandoned by their government and economic system. The article also fails to factor in per diem amounts and the tax advantage that goes with that. As a pilot with one of the aforementioned regionals, this is an ongoing conversation. Why are we encouraging a race to the bottom? Failing that, they were determined to not pay one dime more than their competition. 4) $6,000 annually towards my tuition! Maybe wait and see? MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands Since most flight attendants are women - it also shows how Neeleman views females. To eat while traveling. less than daily to leisure/small markets. Second, the amount of flights they'll even have to offer in their first year or two is relatively small but not surprising for the type of flying they're doingie. Its their choice. This has been the business model of little outfits like this for 30 years. See more about our ethics policies here. Many of those interns go on to be millionaires, build businesses, and manage to be +5 insightful and funny. To that end, it's not that much different than regular college life (many students work part time), but you won't burden yourself with huge college debt because those kids won't have to worry about tuition and housing. 10 years have passed, the salary for new FO's are basically the same but now you need at least 10 year as FO to become a captain. Housing and travel to/from work provided. Who here wants to entrust their lives to "fresh" ill-paid FAs? And which also clearly states that there will be no contract renewal. Or what if you decide to get children? It is a pity that in this country, health care should fall on the shoulders of an employer or the employee. Which means, the flight attendant occupation is DIRECTLY responsible for marketing the company to the public. I think it will succeed as long as they can attract enough flight attendants on an ongoing basis. It's official: Breeze is no different from any other creepy Mormon MLM scheme. Having been a flight attendant I can tell you 15 days is not part time. While we do try to list all the best miles and points deals, the site does not include all card companies or credit card offers available in the marketplace. Before we get into the details of Breezes pilot pay, and compare it to pay at other airlines, note that: First year Breeze pilots will make $36,300. The starting and long-term salaries offered by Breeze Airway are as follows for First Officers and Captains: First Officers: $55 an hour raise to $94 an hour by the sixth year of employment, Captains: $117 an hour raised to $143 an hour by year six of flying with the company. And, it's not clear if they get health insurance as part-time employees. The race to the bottom continues. Kendor coming out strongly in favor of Gilded Age company towns, I see. Many young girls and guys want to be a flight attendant from 20-65 or older. Housing is a huge hurdle for new flight attendants. 28 years represented by ALPA, walked the picket line 29 days in 1985 and was ready to do it again several times during my career to entice management to come to the negotiating table with a better contract for pilots. Even if it flies at first, at some point of growth, you won't be able to justify career training. Word is Allegiant about to get a TA/contract that surpasses our own in pay, benefits etc. New airline Breeze Airways releases hourly wage numbers. 'Fly Breeze for peanuts' could be a marketing slogan aimed at pilots as well as passengers. Most people care about price and reasonably courtesy interactions. Neeleman has a track record of success in the industry, so Im curious to see how this venture works out. We spend $100K plus on flight training plus college for most of us. People may weigh each differently but those are the top three for nearly all travelers. No thank you! You get paid to sign up more people to pay union dues. Glad I was just in time to work and fly through the good times and happily retired now. Are all the posts from FAs at other airlines? A union can negotiate for the whole group, unity makes force. I wonder if its plausible he could bring some pilots up from Azul to fill gaps if US pilots arent too interested? As in, Gompers? Would much rather have spent my time working for peanuts high in the sky, and jetting to interesting places. Airline startup Breeze Airways is set to offer Pilots uncompetitive pay in comparison to the rest of the airline industry. Tons of excess pilot supply at the moment. 2. The most qualified and competent FA candidates will not be happy with a job that is not only poorly paid, but offers next-to-zero chances of becoming a career with that employer, while being viewed negatively by the career employers in the field. Procter and Gamble, I'm thinking of you! . I already feel bad for the disadvantaged kids that will end up getting wrangled into this to help pay for a couple semesters of college. Do public transportation and see the sites that are free. Does everyone just think about cost of a ticket, but not how safe the aircraft are? This article mentions and quotes minimum monthly guarantee, but fails to show the pay for picking up extra flying. Breeze Now, Pay Later. When it comes to Breeze Airways, theres good news and bad news. Then, when mainline hiring picks-up (as it inevitably will) they'll dump Breeze like a cheap date. I think it will succeed as long as they can attract enough flight attendants on an ongoing basis. 3) People as interns/college kids: I would like to have a job for life. PEOPLExpress anyone? Breeze will hire the lowest time, least skilled pilots begging for their first "jet job", just like all the regionals do. There is no contract (at will employment) and health insurance is provided and optional. Once the market rebounds they will have to adjust the MMG to remain competitive. *Layovers will be rare (mechanical issues, weather), trip planning will be turns out and back same day. And I agree with the fellow poster RE: all very young kids, limited work experience not what Id want in an emergency. Not Verified | Breeze is an interesting new airline with pros and cons. For those who get hired by Breeze in this first round, I would imagine they'd be happy campers in a few years. Kinda like this site makes money signing people up for credit cards. "Filet mignon sandwich?" Because it is an opportunity to teach them the skills to land a career or job that they would not have otherwise had a chance for. Yes, they are using and abusing us. Housing and travel to/from work provided. That rate of pay is so low and that availability schedule requires so much flexibility that I have to imagine he isn't targeting primarily college students, who have class schedules to contend with, but high school graduates and GED holders up through their early 20s. Not my kind of thing. How often is the minimum guaranteed hours exceeded in a given month? Free shipping for many products! 2. Our Pilots are overall Leaders who safely take care of our Team Members and Guests. They understand that our pursuit of Excellence is not a destination, but rather, a journey. I think the deal is too good to be true while others think it's chump change and will never work. My view is something of a combination of many of the other posts. Even liberal-minded folks who support workers grow to hate the rhetoric surrounding unions and union actions. Chances if you have surgery, you already have. Wondering about pilot recruitment/requirements. Of course, what's needed is a severe pilot shortage to really change up the whole industry. Log into your account. Clearly Breeze has already figured out that people who fall into their trap will regret their circumstances; that's why Breeze is also making them sign a 4-year contract. Also, let's be honest: COVID is a new reality for pilots. The a la carte formula is very popular whether you personally like it or not. As the app is described: That app, Neeleman says, is designed to convince customers to shell out for upgrades and extras, from food to rental cars, which Breeze is depending on to turn a profit. They are not hired to be sex symbols and keep men sexually entertained through out the flight; therefore, I could care less how old you are as long as you can save my life in the event of an emergency. This is absolutely exploitive. This article mentions and quotes minimum monthly guarantee, but fails to show the pay for picking up extra flying. But.can't raise interest. I am over the moon thrilled! No other large country trains and hires their airline pilots the way we do. I would think having your own place paid for as an apartment or even sharing would save you $6000 a month at least. Minimum wage in Utah is $7.25/hr and cost of living there is pretty low. I worked as a host at a restaurant for minimum wage in college and didnt make close to $1200/mo and still had full tuition and room/board to pay. Where do I sign up? Never found out what would happen if you fall below 3.0. Guess if you cannot beat them, whisper sweet anti-mormon cult. 1) Against unions: not every employee is good at negotiating. The concept does turn on to be "too good to be true" at least for me, just based on the insurance matter alone. This same thing happened in Brazil with Azul. The end result will be lesser pilots and more accidents in the future. I wish more airlines provided housing options. Breeze will initially fly 118-seat Embraer 195s, but eventually plans to operate a fleet consisting exclusively of Airbus A220s. I will be marching tomorrow on May Day for an egalitarian communist revolution with hundreds of myvworking class comrades in Brooklyn. I do not believe for a minute service will be worse than economy on AA or UA. *Layovers will be rare (mechanical issues, weather), trip planning will be turns out and back same day. 2) housing: I am curious what housing? Have you gone to college? Whatta country! There are a finite quantity of qualified pilots and the barrier to entry for that work is significant. I can't always trust a computer system to give me the perks or pay attention to the details I care about. Nice, new and nonstop. There have been several regionals that have gone under recently which have temporarily flooded the market with pilots. There's a lot of old pilots - is Neeleman hiring them because of their looks, or because they know how to fly a plane? These days she brings home a little bit more than that: she earned it. Either talk about what JBs starting rates were when they launched or write this article in 5 years and Ill think differently. See point 2. The estimated base pay is $3,842 per month. And they likely will try to launch with no union, am I right? A union can negotiate for the whole group, unity makes force. I'm a 'union guy' for sure. I think the FAA needs to look into this. As a society we have started to forget the notion of a first job leading to better skills and better salary. Many may not have developed interactional skills with customers (passengers) and feel this job can help teach them that skill. Breeze vs. JetBlue pilot pay Here's JetBlue's Embraer 190 pilot pay scale: First officers are paid $89 per hour in year one, and $130 per hour in year six Captains are paid $192 per hour in year one, and $203 per hour in year six Pilots are guaranteed pay for 75 hours per month of flying In other words: I am over the moon thrilled! Great article !!! Lets compare Breezes pilot pay to that of a couple of other airlines: Heres JetBlues Embraer 190 pilot pay scale: JetBlue Embraer 190 pilots get paid way more. Breeze Airways PAYSCALES CAPTAIN PAY SCALE (Hourly) FIRST OFFICER PAY SCALE (Hourly) PAY CALCULATOR (Click and drag the sliders) Pay Rate: $150 Credit Time: 75 Hours Bid Periods: 1 Percentage: 1 $11,250 PAY NOTES Monthly Pay Guarantee for Line Holders: 70 hours Monthly Pay Guarantee for Reserves: 70 hours PER DIEM Scheduled pay raises: Yearly Maybe housing benefit becomes a retention factor, but beyond that the high turnover seems like it would risk leveling out the reduced labor costs. The next step from airlines would probably challenge the FAA rule of 1 FA per 50 pax. . Breeze Will Pay Flight Attendants $1,200 Per Month, Wants To Ding Your Credit Card Ben Schlappig Published: April 29, 2021 Updated: August 12, 2022 99 With Avelo Airlines having launched operations yesterday, Breeze Airways is expected to be the next US airline startup to begin flying. So, that will be difficult. Expect PGD, IAG, SFB, ORH, RFD, PIT and to change seasonally. Some interns are unpaid. It's silly to ape outrage when we don't know a lot of the details of the actual work and schedule. And many of the commenters on here will fill seats when UA is 5x the price on the same route regardless of what they think of labor rights or real college education. The initiative will see flight attendants be paid a fixed sum of $1,200 each month. Almost every airline has it in the @Samuel - Housing is a big plus and at Breeze it is included. . Breeze's minimum qualifications The basic requirements to become a Breeze pilot come down to flight hours. I liked the idea of them providing housing so I didn't have to scramble to find a crash pad or sign a lease somewhere. Thats exactly what I got from reading the article.. Hello Travis and thank you for the advice. How will Breeze compensate flight attendants? D. Delta Echo Well-Known Member. Never found out what would happen if you fall below 3.0. What sets Breeze Airways hourly salaries apart is the monthly hourly guarantee, which is only 55 hours, or at most, $7,865 per month before taxes (for Captains in their sixth year). The LDS coming from the Beehive State have, at the end of the day, always thought of its team members really as worker bees. But lets say you have a couple of days off. El Segundo, CA 90245. But it may be a great opportunity for some as I said for 1-2 years for a young person. The Dept. Not if you wanted good work done. I applied for a ticket/ramp/gate/baggage handler position and got the job. The Breeze pilots, once hired, will see the Neeleman is begging for a pilot union to quickly form on his new airline, whether he knows it or not. Neeleman is known for building airlines with great cultures, but I kind of have a hard time getting behind this whole concept at Breeze. Don't knock it - they may be seeing how they can yield sufficient FA's before they go a different route entirely. The low cost price they originally show you is a scam. When I spoke to Utah Valley Univ recruiters they hinted heavily the program was designed for the under 25 crowd. @Jason -- Sprit is not that profitable, certainly nowhere close to Delta. But after all these furloughed guys get hired, who then? In fact, the concept seems brilliant and hope I make it through the process and get selected. Also: are families welcome? The systems are good at remembering my preferences though. MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands You think the fact they've bought a union card somehow empowers them with experience? Anyone have any info on what flying for Breeze Airways is like? How much do Breeze Airways employees make? 3) Solid work experience in my chosen industry! So, before any taxes at all, they would be looking at $20-30/hr. You have successfully joined our subscriber list. Why not schedule surgery with a doctor as an intern? the percentage of revenues it gets to keep, but because Spirit makes so little revenue on their high-cost investments they don't add up to much. There's a good chance that well-spoken, polished, and slightly tired surgeon you call "doctor", who has "MD" on their snappy-looking business card, and who so patiently listens to all of your ailments and deep thoughts about dizziness and tinnitus is a resident physician, AKA an intern. They are exploiting pilots. Kinda like most private sector unions. Our point-to-point network means no connections for an easier, quicker and nicer journey. It's silly to ape outrage when we don't know a lot of the details of the actual work and schedule. Some can force their way, others will accept any offer out of fear to lose their job. There are almost 1000 E175/E190 type rated pilots from ExpressJet and Compass. 100% Upvoted. This is corporate serfdom masquerading as an "opportunity". its entrepreneurs and change-makers. I'm sure safety will be first class on Breeze. Does Breeze offer enough pay to pilots? Not how youd describe most 70-year-olds. At the end of last month, the Association of Flight Attendants-CWA - AFA United Master Executive Council analyzed Breeze's program. The airline should do fine, at least up to a certain scale. I expect a complete unbundling a la Spirit but with a much wider, more attractive range of upgrade interests for passengers. To help clarify that, the DoL requires that the intern cannot displace any worker, receive instruction equivalent to or complementary to enrolled coursework. Alaska Airlines Business Card Review: 70K Miles & Lufthansas Boeing 787 Business Class: Exactly As Expected. Please use the form below to contact our customer service or sales team. I will make $15-20 per hour for my hard work on average when you figure all the work we do for free. Im glad to see youre excited to join the industry. Contract of Carriage. They relentlessly play the fear card, citing safety or at times implicitly threatening your safety. Love it! Opinions expressed here are the authors alone, and have not been reviewed, approved or otherwise endorsed by any of these entities. People may weigh each differently but those are the top three for nearly all travelers. JetBlue pilots earn significantly more per hour and are given a 70-hour monthly guarantee. They are offering an employment model that will appeal to some people and no other airline can/will match it so the cost differences should be sustainable. 2) Free Travel! Log in or . That sums up who youll be flying behind if you choose to fly on this completely unproven carrier. And Coke Zero, make it a large. End stage capitalism here people. I'm 41. And if I had a time machine I would go back and slap, poor, poor me silly and tell me to redirect my attention to the unlimited opportunities that were sitting right in front of me every day I drove across the lake and clocked into work. It's quite likely that Breeze wants the low minimum guarantee of 55 so that they can shrink their capacity in the low-demand months without paying pilots to sit. Thread starter aisleguy; Start date Mar 22, 2022; A. aisleguy Well-Known Member. I worked for the now defunct Bar Harbor Airlines in the 80s. ", but I actually challenge you to schedule surgery with a doctor with only a GED. Finally, Breeze needs to get its financial footing or their employees could all be forced out on the street. Their value is astronomical. What do you make of these Breeze insights? Would you pay your doctor, lawyer, nurse, even architect, engineer, electrician, plumber, welder etc. We don't really know enough at this point. He couldn't pay me $1200 to fly them for a month. Breeze Airways is a new airline that's expected to launch in the US in early 2021. Others might say its borderline exploitative. Bottom line: Supply and Demand principles are at play. I wonder if their First Class will have free food and drinks (like JetBlue) or if they're taking the Spirit Big Front Seat approach. So Breeze might get a few "interns" but the vast majority of people wanting the job want to stay there their whole working lives. No one is forcing applicants to accept pay they don't like. I hope he's prepared to pay pilots a real premium, otherwise why go to a startup when the legacies will be hiring big-time. Over time, these airplanes are to be swapped out with Airbus A220s. Very clever. I'm sorry, a career flight attendant is absurd. The job may fit more workers than you think. This airline is banking on their 4 year contract holding up. This job is not nor intended to be for every young person. As a former 40 year flight attendant, I can assure you if there is an emergency on board, you will be in much better off and in much more capable hands with a 25-40 year flight attendant than a 20 year old airhead! Our model gets smarter over time as more people share salaries on Glassdoor. As youd expect, existing flight attendant unions will no doubt be targeting Breeze: The largest U.S. flight attendants union says it looks like an attempt to abuse federal work-study subsidies to hold down labor costs. Highest paying job titles at Breeze Airways include Back-End Software Engineer, Director, Financial Reporting, and Technical Program Manager Total value of jobs: $12,985,000 Total Jobs: 3. I make it to one-on-one video interview and was told I was too old to join program. It's funny, isn't it the view of things changes upon where you're standing. Let's seean airline you interact with almost completely on an app staffed by young folks with no vested interest in the company or it's success.what could possibly go wrong? This seems more in line with what they should be receiving for compensation. Also: are families welcome? And Moron #27 it's an INTERNSHIP.not a career. Does the fact that all FA positions are, looking at the website, classified as "part-time" allow them to avoid paying for health insurance? JetBlue First Officers: $89 an hour for year 1 and $130 an hour by year 6, Captains at JetBlue: $192 an hour to start, then a climb to $203 an hour by year. A new airline that bills itself as "seriously nice" first took to the skies in 2021. Failing that, they were determined to not pay one dime more than their competition. I wish more airlines provided housing options. Maybe it really is a part-time gig and would be a good fit for a great many people. Free housing with huge tuition reimbursement. So Breeze might get a few "interns" but the vast majority of people wanting the job want to stay there their whole working lives. It's that, or FO Adam absolutely nailed it. Great article !!! They will also receive $6,000 towards tuition for online coursework and company housing. Landing June 2023. In youth I worked fast food full-time for many years. Getting paid $30-$40,000 isnt enough to keep most from leaving after a year. It does sound like not much at the moment, but I think the idea behind it, that for a starting Airline and in the pandamic, to only offer 55h minium is understandable. I'm nearing ATP mins as a CFI and it looks interesting. First Officer 1st year $89 and $130 in year six. Please view our advertising policy page for additional details about our partners. I am sure they expect this, but will like to see what happens. All around me were developers making millions of dollars of year in salary and stock options, and there was little old me, paid hourly making about $28,000 a year in an expensive city. A huge percentage of new flight attendants leave within the first year. We wont pay for nice things. Eight months later our crashpad lease expired. Pilots are guaranteed pay of $75 per month. I considered myself a professional and definitely grew with my profession.. All union issues aside I find it interesting that he has singled out the flight attendants specifically.. Nobody even knows what the work culture, training will be like at this startup, yet look at all of the certainty in these comments already. And @Ben L. is still reminiscing the best cars in the world evar, made by 100% union labor in the 1980s. Would you like to buy a filet mignon sandwich that we can hand deliver to you in your seat? Just add all these fun little add-ons where you can just click yes, yes, yes. And we can just keep dinging the credit card.. How many people truly seek out higher prices for labor solidarity? I suspect the *average* monthly paid hours across the whole year will be a lot higher. FO Adam absolutely nailed it. document.getElementById( "ak_js" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); My neighbor is in this program. They know how lousy the job market is right now, and Im sure they have a very good idea of what the numbers are going to look like, not only now, but in the coming months and years when it comes to out-of-work pilots. The article also fails to factor in per diem amounts and the tax advantage that goes with that. Impressive to see how discussion of new airline business immediately decedents into anti-religious bigotry. 1) Why not schedule surgery with a "doctor as an intern.?". Breeze Airways is finally making its debut on May 27 just in time for Memorial Day weekend and the start of what will likely be a busy summer season. How awful that Neeleman is forcing people to work under these conditions with a gun to their head! Stay connected with the latest travel, aviation, and credit card news. If not the airplane no flight. Lots of opinion injected here but believe me they do not have a shortage of applications. This means pilots (not just new pilots ) are out there making with the government wants minimum wage to be.
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